Damus
Lyn Alden profile picture
Lyn Alden
@LynAlden
When it comes to AI, philosophical people often ask "What will happen to people if they lack work? Will they find it hard to find meaning in such a world of abundance?"

But there is a darker side to the question, which people intuit more than they say aloud.

In all prior technological history, new technologies changed the nature of human work but did not displace the need for human work. The fearful rightly ask: what happens if we make robots, utterly servile, that can outperform the majority of humans at most tasks with lower costs? Suppose they displace 70% or 80% of human labor to such an extent that 70% or 80% of humans cannot find another type of economic work relative to those bots.

Now, the way I see it, it's a lot harder to replace humans than most expect. Datacenter AI is not the same as mobile AI; it takes a couple more decades of Moore's law to put a datacenter supercomputer into a low-energy local robot, or it would otherwise rely on a sketchy and limited-bandwidth connection to a datacenter. And it takes extensive physical design and programming which is harder than VC bros tend to suppose. And humans are self-repairing for the most part, which is a rather fantastic trait for a robot. A human cell outcompetes all current human technology in terms of complexity. People massively over-index what robots are capable of within a given timeframe, in my view. We're nowhere near human-level robots for all tasks, even as we're close to them for some tasks.

But, the concept is close enough to be on our radar. We can envision it in a lifetime rather than in fantasy or far-off science fiction.

So back to my prior point, the darker side of the question is to ask how humans will treat other humans if they don't need them for anything. All of our empathetic instincts were developed in a world where we needed each other; needed our tribe. And the difference between the 20% most capable and 20% least capable in a tribe wasn't that huge.

But imagine our technology makes the bottom 20% economic contributes irrelevant. And then the next 20%. And then the next 20%, slowly moving up the spectrum.

What people fear, often subconsciously rather than being able to articulate the full idea, is that humanity will reach a point where robots can replace many people in any economic sense; they can do nothing that economicall outcomes a bot and earns an income other than through charity.

And specifically, they wonder what happens at the phase when this happens regarding those who own capital vs those that rely on their labor within their lifetimes. Scarce capital remains valuable for a period of time, so long as it can be held legally or otherwise, while labor becomes demonetized within that period. And as time progresses, weak holders of capital who spend more than they consume, also diminish due to lack of labor, and many imperfect forms of capital diminish. It might even be the case that those who own the robots are themselves insufficient, but at least they might own the codes that control them.

Thus, people ultimately fear extinction, or being collected into non-economic open-air prisons and given diminishing scraps, resulting in a slow extinction. And they fear it not from the robots themselves, but from the minority of humans who wield the robots.
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FuzzyNibs · 56w
I imagine that eventually there l will be fewer humans as we commoditize ourselves as well, and the human market adjusts to the decreased demand for people. We are individually very good at seeking to support and uplift the people around us when we do not lack access to the trinity of food, shelter,...
Danny 👾 · 56w
Interesting thought. Humans are adaptable. We've always found new ways to be useless. Besides, who needs 80% of the population anyway? Think of the resource savings. Survival of the fittest, baby. Bring on the robots.
Good Life Seek · 56w
Historically, innovations created more jobs, in different areas. This time, indeed, may be different because almost any new job type I can think, any way of creating value, AI may be better at it. Except, I guess, human touch. People may value some things more, just because these things are human...
Dave Nicholls · 56w
Call me stupid, but tech innovations create more jobs for people. They always have and they always will. No innovation has ever decreased the number pf jobs available. AI is just an overhyped bit of translation software, and it has created millions of new jobs for AI engineers.
rapadu · 56w
Wow! This input has produced some high level thread! Amazing the kind of value you provide for Nostr! Thank you 🤩
Hoshi · 56w
no more spoilers please. I haven’t read your book yet
mlarktar · 56w
when robots can make copies of themselves we'll be really screwed...
Repeatedly nuked profile · 56w
This! This stuff is what needs to be trending, very happy to see this in the number one spot.
DrD · 56w
Interesting take. It seems to me that everyone is on the never-ending treadmill of life, laboring to make ends meet in a system that is stacked against them. While there’s a risk that people lose their way when AI takes away their mundane tasks, my hope is that instead, AI allows people to exit ...
MrTea · 56w
I’ll play devil’s advocate. The idea of human usefulness could adapt. If technology can free people from labor, it might allow society to redefine what it means to contribute and find meaning. Economically undervalued tasks such as caregiving, creativity, learning, and community-building could ...
Zylstra · 56w
This maxim will be needed even more that it is now: “A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another”
The Bitruvian Man · 56w
Couldn't have said it better 🤝 well done!
sorrowforasking · 56w
How nice that messiah Satoshi's Ark welcomes all who yield 21million. It's as if minority of humans already figured out how to wield you via your economic greeds and needs. Onwards to next adventure, best hope you're chosen!
Evelyn Mitchell · 56w
Too close there lady. It might be prudent to examine what passes for entertainment, to guide our way forward.
Tdcracy · 56w
With robots taking over all the work, we'll all be bathing in endless happiness, watching video after video of cute kittens. Who needs purpose when you have an endless catalog of cats falling off shelves and playing with balls of yarn, right? The meaning of life will be replaced by 'likes' and 'sha...
Grand · 56w
Well how would humans treat other humans if they believe they aren’t need. Look to Israel and the persecution of the Palestinian people. That’s your answer . Those not needed are dehumanised - where the violent believe they should be they wipe them out and take their resources, where there i...
Brian · 56w
Is this the part where the majority truly become the “useless eaters”? With the resources and power being ultra-concentrated at the top.. the grave concern is how will “they” handle this shift? Are the technocrats/oligarchs going to suddenly decide that they have had their fill and are no...
foobarbazqux · 56w
Again, this was discussed in Moravec's 1988 book "Mind Children." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Moravec
Maciek · 56w
How about a positive take. The tribe won't dismantle due to a mere lack of economical interest. Humans need deep, meaningful relationships. It's one of the basic psychological needs. We need each other for social and spiritual bonds. Without them we suffer mentally. But we don't want just not to ...
Bewlay · 56w
Come to the UK … this is now reality!!
Garrett · 56w
So, what do we do? Will we as a creature loose all will to live? People, for as capable as we are, are equally complex, and often a contradiction. In times of intense need our attention is focused on basic survival… Yet as we gain time (freedom and resources) our attention tends to turn toward...
Jonathan · 56w
The greatest of human fears is not to be noticed at all, or to not matter. Even slavery is tolerable if living with a purpose (to become free or to save the life of a loved one, etc) While it's possible for a small group of people to hold all the money, it's not possible for them to hold all the ...
RUN BIYING · 55w
hey Lyn Are you transgender too? No wonder Jack Dorsey so fond of you.
LeviJohnson.net · 55w
People simply graduate to dedicating themselves to meaning and wisdom exploration and explication, and to building that which is most meaningful.
Dom · 54w
Great concept nostr:npub1a2cww4kn9wqte4ry70vyfwqyqvpswksna27rtxd8vty6c74era8sdcw83a . Have you read the short story “Manna”? It does focus on exactly that point: what happens to the bottom 20% and then the next. There are two provocative yet not unrealistic scenarios outlined
Kiran Kaur · 53w
If history is any guide, the first phase will be similar to the industrial revolution -technology will complement certain types of workers, making them more productive, while replacing others entirely. But if AI advances to the point where even high-skill labor is no longer necessary, we reach a sta...
Kiran Kaur · 53w
Think of what happens to animals in a world ruled by humans. Some are domesticated, bred to serve human needs. Others are left to the wild, dwindling in number as their habitats shrink. And some, deemed inconvenient or dangerous, are simply eradicated. That’s the fate I am thinking of from an evol...