@Five
I ship freedom tech
Relays (2)
- wss://nos.lol/ – read & write
- wss://relay.primal.net/ – write
Recent Notes
The "Uncle Jim" model looks like a pretty dumb idea looking back.
I never got to it, I was always uncomfortable with this model. Perhaps it's for a very narrow group of people.
I'm not one if them.
So I just created a website that is pure PoW to complete and directed everyone interested towards that. A good decision looking back.
I start it along the lines of "self custody is hard whatever anyone told you. It requires enduring effort."
The "AnYOne Can wriTE dOWn 12 wORds" crew should be ashamed.
The "here's my 15 steps tutorial" people should be ashamed.
And we need to rethink all of this really hard.
I never got to it, I was always uncomfortable with this model. Perhaps it's for a very narrow group of people.
I'm not one if them.
So I just created a website that is pure PoW to complete and directed everyone interested towards that. A good decision looking back.
I start it along the lines of "self custody is hard whatever anyone told you. It requires enduring effort."
The "AnYOne Can wriTE dOWn 12 wORds" crew should be ashamed.
The "here's my 15 steps tutorial" people should be ashamed.
And we need to rethink all of this really hard.
Flipping coins > rolling dice
Can combine (XOR) both sources. Cards and image entropy are also options worth exploring
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How to add Google login to your app without having private keys in your app or handing them to Google: https://viewsource.win/fiatjaf.com/pomegranate
A very dry demo of its capabilities: https://pome...
I would really love this to be a thing but don't you think this makes already brittle nip46 logins even more shaky?
1
you said you love keys but then you describe a flow in which you just take a relay hint from a community and use that for everything?
sounds like a relay-centric approach
Relay hints are key first because they are like signposts (pun intended) that show you a trusted direction where to go from there.
Trusted if it comes from a key you trust.
Hardcoding relays in apps is relay first approach. If I must know what relay to query before anything else, it is not optimal.
We want to connect with people firstly, machines should be secondary.
Trusted if it comes from a key you trust.
Hardcoding relays in apps is relay first approach. If I must know what relay to query before anything else, it is not optimal.
We want to connect with people firstly, machines should be secondary.
1
you said you love keys but then you describe a flow in which you just take a relay hint from a community and use that for everything?
sounds like a relay-centric approach
Relay hints come from keys, they are signposts (pun intended) where something is. That is a key-first approach, a hint you can trust if you trust the key.
Nostr is in part a collective map of the internet. You found an event anywhere even from outside nostr, and from that entrypoint you can go further with relay hints that can be extracted in multiple ways from an event: mentions of people or other events mostly, in multiple forms.
What I am not particularly fond of is relay-first discovery but I understand it could also be beneficial like when I say "I'm running xyz relay check it out it has interesting content".
But this is better served with an event link like an nevent naddr nprofile or such. That is key first.
The reason is, relays go down, people rotate their stuff, quotas are filled so events get evicted etc. Keys don't usually rotate or much more rarely. People over infrastructure. We want to interact with people and so machines must be secondary.
Nostr is in part a collective map of the internet. You found an event anywhere even from outside nostr, and from that entrypoint you can go further with relay hints that can be extracted in multiple ways from an event: mentions of people or other events mostly, in multiple forms.
What I am not particularly fond of is relay-first discovery but I understand it could also be beneficial like when I say "I'm running xyz relay check it out it has interesting content".
But this is better served with an event link like an nevent naddr nprofile or such. That is key first.
The reason is, relays go down, people rotate their stuff, quotas are filled so events get evicted etc. Keys don't usually rotate or much more rarely. People over infrastructure. We want to interact with people and so machines must be secondary.
I love relays. But I love keys more.
If the app is about discovering relays first and keys/accounts second, I don't like that.
Bootstrapping is okay of course but we need to fan out based on keys.
#BudaBit is hardcoding a default ncommunity which is a pubkey for a community with relay hints where its definition event is. This is a default entrypoint. There are indexer relays as well but they are not strictly needed.
Even the default ncommunity can be avoided if you know another community you can just search it.
Even outbox model (nip65) is optional with the community-first model because everything is published to your communities as well.
I like this model it simplifies much of the complexity of nostr.
If the app is about discovering relays first and keys/accounts second, I don't like that.
Bootstrapping is okay of course but we need to fan out based on keys.
#BudaBit is hardcoding a default ncommunity which is a pubkey for a community with relay hints where its definition event is. This is a default entrypoint. There are indexer relays as well but they are not strictly needed.
Even the default ncommunity can be avoided if you know another community you can just search it.
Even outbox model (nip65) is optional with the community-first model because everything is published to your communities as well.
I like this model it simplifies much of the complexity of nostr.
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#BudaBit communities can offer all kinds of services to their members :
- Blossom media servers
- Grasp git servers
- CI in the future
- Community relay as DM inbox
- Email alert service
-... Many more perhaps in the future
Users choose their preferences based on their community memberships. Communities can protect services based on membership whitelists but BudaBit will only offer options where user is a member at least.
Communities will eventually charge for services or introduce some business model to stay sustainable.
They have incentives to provide good quality.
They might advertise services they themselves are proxying to the user from a reliable provider.
Many possible solutions. The overarching theme is that platforms are broken down into communities and services: An open market driven by organic trust and authentic connections.
Everyone wins.
#community #communikeys
- Blossom media servers
- Grasp git servers
- CI in the future
- Community relay as DM inbox
- Email alert service
-... Many more perhaps in the future
Users choose their preferences based on their community memberships. Communities can protect services based on membership whitelists but BudaBit will only offer options where user is a member at least.
Communities will eventually charge for services or introduce some business model to stay sustainable.
They have incentives to provide good quality.
They might advertise services they themselves are proxying to the user from a reliable provider.
Many possible solutions. The overarching theme is that platforms are broken down into communities and services: An open market driven by organic trust and authentic connections.
Everyone wins.
#community #communikeys
11❤️1
Nostr vibe check: people are calling me a "whore" because, as far as I can tell, I bought a defective product? Or maybe because I get paid for my work? This place man. I am this close to just never lo...
Glad you made it.
Two things I am grateful for:
1. In crises people show their true self
2. The "public square" displaying how defunct it is, and how inhumane. Organic communities are the answer to rebuild some trust in today's culture.
Two things I am grateful for:
1. In crises people show their true self
2. The "public square" displaying how defunct it is, and how inhumane. Organic communities are the answer to rebuild some trust in today's culture.
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Yes, things fucking suck right now. Something that should've never happened has happened, and is still happening as I'm typing these lines. The consequence? Innocent, hard-working people are getting r...
Well said, in a way we should all feel responsible.
Safe travels!
Safe travels!
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Codeberg started a witch-hunt against LLM-generated software:
https://blog.codeberg.org/protecting-our-floss-commons-from-llms.html
"
As we want to center on human collaboration, we will not actively support or engage in the creation of LLMs and will not put our limited resources to use for storing single-use software that would pollute our FLOSS commons.
"
The article goes on and on about how agents make open source worse. I don't think this is the case.
I think they make it much better for those who have the right perspective.
That is, the free market capitalist view of Nostr, not the socialist view of "free of charge".
The fundamental error they make is complaining about people writing more software and taking advantage of their "free" resources rather than embracing the new paradigm and the creative flourishing that AI means, and riding the wave.
Nothing prevents them from charging for their services in a smart per usage way. They have a good momentum now that GitHub has suffered so much reputation losses. They could be smart and charge fees while letting some people to apply for free quotas. The business opportunities are endless. They could become sustainable without begging for donations and be on top of the trend.
No. Let's not make money. Instead burn our resources on hunting down software projects that use LLM. This is pure socialism.
Seems like we need Nostr more than ever. The spirit of nostr is "make everything an open market where the best providers win". This is only achievable by embracing the new radically turbulent paradigm, and use bitcoin and web of trust to install much needed limitations.
This is the freedom market rather than "free" masquerading as oppressive. Nothing comes closer to achieving the freedom market driven internet than Nostr.
Projects like #BudaBit and #GitWorkshop embody this in my opinion.
Keep building, keep shipping!
https://blog.codeberg.org/protecting-our-floss-commons-from-llms.html
"
As we want to center on human collaboration, we will not actively support or engage in the creation of LLMs and will not put our limited resources to use for storing single-use software that would pollute our FLOSS commons.
"
The article goes on and on about how agents make open source worse. I don't think this is the case.
I think they make it much better for those who have the right perspective.
That is, the free market capitalist view of Nostr, not the socialist view of "free of charge".
The fundamental error they make is complaining about people writing more software and taking advantage of their "free" resources rather than embracing the new paradigm and the creative flourishing that AI means, and riding the wave.
Nothing prevents them from charging for their services in a smart per usage way. They have a good momentum now that GitHub has suffered so much reputation losses. They could be smart and charge fees while letting some people to apply for free quotas. The business opportunities are endless. They could become sustainable without begging for donations and be on top of the trend.
No. Let's not make money. Instead burn our resources on hunting down software projects that use LLM. This is pure socialism.
Seems like we need Nostr more than ever. The spirit of nostr is "make everything an open market where the best providers win". This is only achievable by embracing the new radically turbulent paradigm, and use bitcoin and web of trust to install much needed limitations.
This is the freedom market rather than "free" masquerading as oppressive. Nothing comes closer to achieving the freedom market driven internet than Nostr.
Projects like #BudaBit and #GitWorkshop embody this in my opinion.
Keep building, keep shipping!
11
guess I'll point my agent at your implementation and the nip-29 one. and the buzz one while I'm at it.
I really want a gated read/write access to relay, have implemented one of my own as a plugin on ...
Please do. The reason BudaBit works with any relay is that moderation is enforced client side.
The missing piece is optional enforcement on the relay side which would come with the tradeoff of tying the group to a relay-specific implementation.
Basic rate limits can be applied without moderation enforcement though. Some group leaders might want this tradeoff but I don't think it's a prio.
I thought about badges used for moderation but found that a group might need them for simple engagement drivers and overloading them with moderation semantics seemed too much.
Went for simple lists therefore, scoped to arbitrary content scopes. Also if forms are used in BudaBit to grant access (you can build any form you require for applicants to fill out), a like or dislike reaction records an immutable evidence trail of why that guy was admitted.
Everything is documented your agent should sum it up easily.
The missing piece is optional enforcement on the relay side which would come with the tradeoff of tying the group to a relay-specific implementation.
Basic rate limits can be applied without moderation enforcement though. Some group leaders might want this tradeoff but I don't think it's a prio.
I thought about badges used for moderation but found that a group might need them for simple engagement drivers and overloading them with moderation semantics seemed too much.
Went for simple lists therefore, scoped to arbitrary content scopes. Also if forms are used in BudaBit to grant access (you can build any form you require for applicants to fill out), a like or dislike reaction records an immutable evidence trail of why that guy was admitted.
Everything is documented your agent should sum it up easily.
What are the limitation you found in nip29?
It's heavily designed around the relay.
I needed sth that makes migration as easy as possible, and works with any relay by default.
Moderation is all or nothing, there's no content-scoping.
NIP42 auth introduces all kinds of hard-to-debug complexity.
Protected tags don't work in reality.
Introduces a bunch of extra kinds for little gain.
See Flotilla and browse some groups there. You will find a lot of inconsistencies what groups look like because implementations are fragmented and browsing relays is confusing.
It's a mishmash of ideas piled up into a mess to satisfy too many people's ideas.
I needed sth that makes migration as easy as possible, and works with any relay by default.
Moderation is all or nothing, there's no content-scoping.
NIP42 auth introduces all kinds of hard-to-debug complexity.
Protected tags don't work in reality.
Introduces a bunch of extra kinds for little gain.
See Flotilla and browse some groups there. You will find a lot of inconsistencies what groups look like because implementations are fragmented and browsing relays is confusing.
It's a mishmash of ideas piled up into a mess to satisfy too many people's ideas.