Damus
Jack K profile picture
Jack K
@Jackk

Bitcoin Chronologist
Bitcoin = Quantum Computer
There is no wave

Relays (13)
  • wss://nos.lol – read & write
  • wss://bitcoiner.social – read & write
  • wss://relay.nostr.net – read & write
  • wss://relay.primal.net – read & write
  • wss://chillstr.nostr1.com/xenon-flint – read & write
  • wss://relay.bitcoindistrict.org/lantern-mike-vertex – read & write
  • wss://nostr.wine – read & write
  • wss://nostr.land – read & write
  • wss://relay.minibits.cash – read & write
  • wss://fanfares.nostr1.com/yankee-raven-raven – read & write
  • wss://relay.fountain.fm – read & write
  • wss://premium.primal.net – read & write
  • wss://relay.damus.io – read & write

Recent Notes

JD · 3d
The narrative war. I was agreeing with you
Jack K profile picture
Yeah I am curious how it will all play out. Seems to ramping up. My base case is we will see a hard fork, but I could be wrong.

Hodling is going to become very interesting as we attempt to hone in on an objective definition of Bitcoin thru decentalized consensus. Protocol design must be grounded in physical objectivity. Knowledge of Bitcoin, is good for Bitcoin. Exciting!
Himel · 3d
Yoooo, 🤘
mleku · 3d
> can you give a brief summary of how Shor's algorithm works, and what properties of the computer you run it on make it feasible shor's algorithm factors integers by reducing factoring to period-finding, then solving period-finding with a quantum fourier transform. steps: pick random a coprime t...
Jack K profile picture
Who here on nostr can actually discuss the logic and assumptions of centralized quantum computing for all of the plebs to see?

It’s absolute nonsense for anyone to claim a theory of physics that cannot resolve the measurement problem and produces paradox poses a threat to a PoW (physics) system that supersedes theory and IS the definition of measurement. Nobody understands Bitcoin enough to claim such a threat; nobody.

Where are the thinkbois? I’m not going to X to talk about Bitcoin. It’s time physics answers for the double spend problem, or admit the theory is fiat for us all to see.
mleku · 3d
that quote is from the BIP-360 page post quantum algorithms are a good thing. they are using merkle trees which layer hash functions. hashing the spend key into an address achieves the same thing, wi...
Jack K profile picture
I guess I just strip it further back to the assumption that PQ sigs are even needed. My whole argument is that we need to verify the assumption of CQC again based on the physics Bitcoin demonstrates logically rather than our fiat assumptions. Joules, bits and blocks. Question, who are you trusting to claim such a threat? What is their incentive? I need someone to explain to me how discrete subplanck superposition poses a threat to Bitcoin, because that is the only logical architecture that resolves the measurement/double spend problem in physics while explaining the particle and the wave. The architecture is empirical in Bitcoin. Resolve the double spend and prove conservation without a quantized block of time; you cannot. If that’s the case, I need to be shown how CQC can remain plausible if time must be quantized at Planck scale. So yes, the physics matters greatly here, because I don’t trust anyone’s physics who is claiming there is a quantum threat and I will URSF.

The double spend problem is a physics problem. It’s a logic problem. It’s a conservation problem. It’s the measurement problem. There is way too much trust in Bitcoin and not enough verification. The double spend problem is not just a “money” problem; it has serious implications for the logic of our physics.

It would be quite a waste of time/energy if we find out we don’t need PQ sigs and that we are introducing more vulnerability into the chain by hubris in doing so. It stems from the idea that Bitcoin (not taproot) is broken or will be broken and needs to change. Nonsense.

If you argue that we need to improve cryptography because of AI, sure I’ll entertain and support this discussion. The threat is not quantum, it never has been, it never will be.
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mleku · 3d
if the compute and data size cost can be brought down to a reasonable distance from the elliptic curves, then it's a minimal cost for a guaranteed defense against successful building of a computer that can run shor's algorithm. it may not even be quantum computers that end up being able to run that ...
mleku · 3d
you and your planck scale "Given the critical role of Taproot addresses in Bitcoin scaling (including Lightning, BitVM, Ark, and other key technologies), we believe it's prudent to ensure that Bitcoi...
Jack K profile picture
Physics matters with respect to understanding the measured relationship of energy, time and memory (information). We cannot define money, or rather memory, without it. It allows us to ground protocol engineering and discussion in objectivity of what we must conserve rather than subjectivity. We have drifted so far.

"Given the critical role of Taproot addresses in Bitcoin scaling (including Lightning, BitVM, Ark, and other key technologies), we believe it's prudent to ensure that Bitcoin has a tapscript-native address output type that is protected from long-exposure quantum attacks." — who said this?

I am with you here man on the nonsense layers. I am all for conservatism and Bitcoin Reduction Proposals that strip back the bloat and reinstate the core economics and logic Satoshi left us with. I think taproot is ephemeral and the quantum fud is ephemeral. Fiat will be rid from our physics eventually and Bitcoin will stand alone and above all theory; Bitcoin is not a theory of physics. I see anyone pushing PQC for Bitcoin as a threat. I will stand by the chain Satoshi gave us. We are the ones breaking Bitcoin in hubris. We have missed the mark.
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mleku · 3d
that quote is from the BIP-360 page post quantum algorithms are a good thing. they are using merkle trees which layer hash functions. hashing the spend key into an address achieves the same thing, with the short time between posting a spend that reveals the key and when it is in a block. i have bee...
mleku · 3d
i think that the fact it allows users to define new transaction types and have them adopted by miners by minting transactions they cannot verify for spends to get them to upgrade is a great idea. but ...
Jack K profile picture
So in your view is BIP360 the nail in the coffin here? I will refute the need to make Bitcoin quantum resistant as the physics that underpins centralized quantum computation is fiat and has not resolved the double spend (measurement) problem of energy/information. A quantized block of time at Planck scale is required to solve the double spend, thus enforce conservation, which pushes Superposition to the sub-Planck interval between the discrete measurement boundaries. The whole logic of CQC is fiat and our desire to change Bitcoin from claims of CQC is peak fiat. BIP360 is not an upgrade to Bitcoin, it is an attack.

Can you elaborate on why we need schnorr UTXOs and sha256d hash shield? I believe future threat will come from AI and classical computation; quantum is the myth for us to hand over the keys to the castle, because we’re too retarded to understand and we must trust the fiat physics.
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mleku · 3d
you and your planck scale "Given the critical role of Taproot addresses in Bitcoin scaling (including Lightning, BitVM, Ark, and other key technologies), we believe it's prudent to ensure that Bitcoin has a tapscript-native address output type that is protected from long-exposure quantum attacks." ...